February 7, 2008
Motors, Cycles
Mayor Daley introduced a new ordinance today that would fine motorists whose reckless behind-the-wheel antics endanger cyclists. Fines from $150-$500 could be levied against drivers who turn in front of someone on a bike, pass with less than three feet of space between car and bike, or door someone.
"When someone opens a door -- that's why you have to be very, very alert on a bike," Daley said."Yes, it's taken place. And [there were] a few choice words. Every biker does that -- salutes the driver in a Chicago way."
Well, we now know what the center square is for our Chicago bingo card: Get flipped off by Mayor Daley. Ah, dreams. [Trib, S-T]
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Nice law, I suppose, though we'll how well it is enforced.
That said, what about increased penalties for bikers who disregard traffic laws, endangering pedestrians and even sometimes walkers? I am sick of getting hit by bikers nearly every week when I cross the street or just walk on sidewalks (another illegal act for most riders inside the city limits).
Bikers know they must follow the rules of the road at all times, right? That goes for all the messenger fucks, too.
According to Break the Gridlock, you can look forward to publicly complaining about the indignities of riding a bike in Chicago next week.
Here's an email I got:
On February 15, at 6:30 PM (till around 9) at Efebos Internet Cafe (1640 S. BlueIsland, just north of 18th Street on Blue Island Avenue) YOU ARE INVITED to participate in a discussion/open mic having to do with alternatives to the Insidious Car Culture.
For bicyclists who will have been protesting the Auto Show it could be an opportunity to tell about theexperience and show any documentation you may have;for others, a chance to share ideas; for some, a chance to complain about the infinite indignities and outrages pedestrians suffer.
Seriously, how awesome would it be to get flicked off by Da Mayer?
If I only had a car...
Let me guess, the fine the motorist receives will go to the CTA but only if the state passes a bill that allows people with psoriasis and displaced Katrina victims to ride for free.
Matilda: Bikers know they must follow the rules of the road at all times, right?
Would you rather the bike pedal his scrawny ass up to 15 mph from a standstill while you tailgate them, or would you rather they get through the intersection and keep moving everyone along as quickly as possible? Even sail power has right of way over motor on the high seas.
That said, what about increased penalties for bikers who disregard traffic laws, endangering pedestrians and even sometimes walkers? I am sick of getting hit by bikers nearly every week when I cross the street or just walk on sidewalks
Yeah, just go ahead and walk out into the intersection. Bikes will still dodge your slow ass. You realize that if you follow your train of thought then you must also increase penalties for walkers who disregard traffic laws.
Just, basically, bikers are invisible to everyone. Most people just walk around in their own little self centered worlds (I don't mean you specifically Matilda, no offense, just making a point here), and bike accidents - 999 times out of 1000 - hurt no one except the cyclist.
This is a great biking city we live in. One of the best in the US. It should be FAR more prevalent as it is in most other parts of the world for SO many good reasons.
how wasn't this already an ordinance?
Matilda: Bikers know they must follow the rules of the road at all times, right?
Would you rather the bike pedal his scrawny ass up to 15 mph from a standstill while you tailgate them, or would you rather they get through the intersection and keep moving everyone along as quickly as possible? Even sail power has right of way over motor on the high seas.
That said, what about increased penalties for bikers who disregard traffic laws, endangering pedestrians and even sometimes walkers? I am sick of getting hit by bikers nearly every week when I cross the street or just walk on sidewalks
Yeah, just go ahead and walk out into the intersection. Bikes will still dodge your slow ass. You realize that if you follow your train of thought then you must also increase penalties for walkers who disregard traffic laws.
Just, basically, bikers are invisible to everyone. Most people just walk around in their own little self centered worlds (I don't mean you specifically Matilda, no offense, just making a point here), and bike accidents - 999 times out of 1000 - hurt no one except the cyclist.
This is a great biking city we live in. One of the best in the US. It should be FAR more prevalent as it is in most other parts of the world for SO many good reasons.
...Something about a server error, unable to post. Sorry about the double post there.
Fuck you, Bronto. Bikers must obey the law, period. What is so fucking hard about that concept? Why do you think bikers deserve special treatment?
I love your stats--did you pull them out of your ass, or someone elses?
Walkers must be responsible, too. I am not arguing they don't. Believe it or not, I do not jaywalk and look both ways at stop signs--any other traffic laws walkers must follow?.
You need to relax and drink less coffee. You're too fucking angry and that makes your position on the subject sound far less intelligent. Be civil and I may actually listen to your opinion.
Excellent post Bronto!
I suspect folks who read about laws protecting cyclists from cars and can only come away with pedestrian complaints don't have much insight into what it's like to try to bike around this city. Cyclists are also pedestrians too half the time. Think about how many pedestrians have been seriously hurt/killed by bikers vs. how many bikers have been hurt and killed by cars. Actually if anyone can conjure one pedestrian incident up without having to use google I'd be amazed. As a pedestrian you are going to be killed by a driver, not a biker.
I feel like often the only alternative to driving that enters people's heads is biking. I often get the impression that people think if you don't bike, well, you must be a horrible person because that means you must have a car or something. Do people forget that there are other alternatives to biking, such as taking the CTA or walking?
I was at the Daily Grind and saw a piece of artwork that had a biker on it that said something along the lines of "don't drive, bike instead."
Yeah, that's great. But I walk and take the CTA, and I have never owned a car in my life. Where's the love?
It's a good law, but what about the biker that fails to follow the rules of the road and the passenger doors someone (something that I have done as a passenger in a taxi because the biker was in the wrong)? I also think this will be hard to enforce. I'm bet the city has a hard time enforcing the "no turn on red" laws--something that really puts pedestrians at risk, how will they be able to enforce this?
And I echo what Matilda says. Everyone needs to follow rules of the road: cars, CTA buses (notorious for running reds), bikers and pedestrians. The arrogance of many bikers--"well, I am on a bike, the drivers need to watch out for me! I don't need to follow the laws!" infuriates me.
Thank you Mayor!! If a driver is cited for hitting me with a door and I happen to taco my $300 front rim or if I do a header over a car that turns in front of me and break my wrist, a copy of the citation will go a long way in getting reimbursed for the damage. What the city really needs is a way for bikers that don't have cars to get bike insurance for those instances where a biker hits a car/pedestrian and is at fault.
I'd love to see a Mayor Mumbles School of Public Speaking and Elocution. Who needs Prof. Henry Higgins?
I don't think people have a problem with stiffer laws against drivers. I certainly do not. The issue I have is that everyone--bikers, drivers, and pedestrians--need to obey the rules of the road. A jaywalker should get ticketed. A driver that hits or doors a biker when the biker is following the rules of the road should get ticketed, and a biker should get ticketed for running a red.
And Bronto, "Would you rather the bike pedal his scrawny ass up to 15 mph from a standstill while you tailgate them, or would you rather they get through the intersection and keep moving everyone along as quickly as possible?"
I don't drive, I walk. When I rarely drive, I obey the rules of the road. I still follow the rules of the road is there is a scrawny assed biker in front of me or a pedestrian. That said, the biker should obey the rules of the road.
How do you reasonably justify violating the law?
If you do not have a car, your renter's insuance or homeowners insurance may cover you for damage. If not, it can probably be added. (Renter's insurance is a good policy to have, too).
You all might want to get it anyway, as the homeowner's/renter's insurance with a bicycle clause will protect you from your negligence should you run a red, disobey traffic laws and get into an accident that is your fault (sounds like many of you just don't like obeying the laws, so it's probably a good idea to have it).
I bike to work almost every day--including winter (this week being an excpetion). I can't tell you how mant times I have almost been hit by cars, taxis, and busses that aren't paying attention or simply don't give a flying f**k that I'm there. Cars passing me and then making a right turn in front of me has almost landed me in the hospital more times than I want to think about. At least an ordinance like this will help when one of them eventually does hit me.
I agree cyclists have to follow the law as well--fine them too if you want when they do dumb things. Unfortunately, following the law as a cyclist does little to stop cars from acting stupid.
I often get the impression that people think if you don't bike, well, you must be a horrible person because that means you must have a car or something.
I don't think that's the case Sparky, I agree though there's nothing more annoying then the "One Less Car!" 'biking is my whole identity' type of person.
Ah, the great bicyclists/drivers/pedestrians debate. Rehashed yet again.
In my experience:
Drivers are the worst. They blow stop signs and lights. The recent death of the pigeon man is a classic example of an idiot taking a "Chicago right" (motorist looks to the left for oncoming traffic but not to the right for pedestrians in the crosswalk). Crunch. I've almost been hit this way numerous times. And of course when you slap the hood, the hurried motorist suddenly has all the time in the world to stop his car and ask you what the hell your problem is.
Pedestrians come next. In Chicago, jaywalking is practically encouraged. In a city so dead set on squeezing as much revenue as possible out of its citizens, I'm amazed the authorities refuse to crack down on this dangerous practice that only adds to the animosity between motorists and pedestrians. I've had the misfortune of seeing what a 2,000 lb vehicle can do to a pedestrian in a hurry. Believe me, it's worth waiting 30 seconds.
Bicyclists are the least dangerous. In 10 years in Chicago, 5 in D.C. and 4 in Baltimore, I've had two close calls with people on bikes -- and both were messengers, so they don't count. Messengers are messengers. If they were doing their jobs on foot or skateboard or rickshaw, they'd be just as crazy. Most people who complain the loudest about cyclists and unblinkingly believe they should stop at all stop signs are suburban people who are not used to being around bikes and got stuck behind one, costing them an extra fifteen seconds of their time before they could swerve around them to be home in time for whatever the hell's on TV.
I drive, walk and bike. Anyone who frequently rides a bike knows that your mere presence on the road brings out a competitive rage in motorists. They'll honk at you, spit at you, throw things at you, and even intentionally bump you with their vehicles. I call it the "get behind me, bitch" factor. See a bike in front of you? SPEED UP! Get in front of that bastard!
Hey, can we re-ignite the smoking ban debate?
Seriously, I do believe drivers are the worst. And yes, I'd love to see bicyclists follow the rules of the road, but in the end, it's the driver that needs to start putting up a better show of responsibility on the roads. Which is why I appreciated the bus driver for slowing down with a bicyclist ahead of us. He didn't ride the guys ass and yet were still moving. Figure that..
These things can all work out, if we all just take our own darn responsbility for making it right.
I am amazed that some bikers think it is OK to blow stop signs, and that at least one person thinks this is evidence of a suburban mentality.
Wow.
Fuck bikers who don't obey the law. I have no pity when your recklessness results in broken bones or cracked skulls. In fact, I laugh when that happens. And fuck the bullshit biker martyr complex, all the suffering you poor bikers must go through.
I don't own a car anymore, but when I had to own one, I would often find myself swerving from reckless bikers blowing signs or lights, or having to stop suddenly because such bikers thought the rules did not apply to them. Those bikers deserve any injury they can get.
But hey, you guys bike, so that must mean you are like Christ or something. Fucking biker subculture in this city--it's pathetic.
Mikely: I've lived in this city for a while. I not quite sure why you think all of the people that complain the loudest about cyclists are the suburbanites.
And I wish people would stop excusing the bike messengers. Yeah, sure their paycheck depends on it, but taxis, limos, courier services, truck drivers, and Domino's Pizza delivery guys--who all depend on a paycheck too--have to obey the same laws. Why are messengers exempt, and why do people excuse it?
Navin: at least I am not the only one.
A couple of bad apple messengers do not excuse the way some drivers act around bikes in this city. I follow the rules, ride with a helmet and lights, and I have been hit twice (both minor accidents luckily). I'm not a one-less-car nut. I just want to be able to ride in the city without a fear of getting doored or right hooked by a driver not paying attention (and likely on their cell phone). While the ordinance may just be a token attempt to get good press, I commend Daley for at least doing something.
there are plenty of bikers out there that ignore all traffic laws when biking. It would be great if more people took there bikes to work les pollution and more parking for me, but this hasnt happened yet. No matter what mode of transportation people with there IPODS on just oblivious to whats going on around them are a hazard cell phones too. But we cant outlaw stupidity. At least not with our current leadership in this city county and state.
Ad, it is good to hear that there are people following the rules. All too often, I hear the "well, I shouldn't have to" holier-than-thou attitude. That sucks that you have been doored and hit. I would like to bike in this city, but for that reason (fear of getting hit), I will not. Someday I may work up the nerve to buy a bike and try it. I just haven't worked up the nerve yet.
Sparky, I strongly encourage you to give it a try. Chicago in the summer on a bike is one of the best ways to see the city. I was the same way the first two years I lived here until my wife talked me into going out. Grab a chicago bike map, which helps find routes that are better to bike on at first.
While Chicago isn't 100% safe (no city with large amounts of traffic will ever be in this country), it isn't nearly as bad as it seems. The problems Chicago has are endemic of the way streets are structured across the country. You get use to riding safely in traffic within a day or two. The problem is when you get too comfortbale riding in traffic, you start to get aggressive (i.e. most messengers). I've had just as many close calls as a pedestrian as I have had on my bike.
Thanks for the encouragement. Maybe this summer, I will give it a shot.
Matilda,
The obvious rage you have against people who bike (who are often drivers and pedestrians as well) and the screeching histrionics you use in your post tell me that even you know that what you're saying's B.S. People who bike have a "martyr complex" because they don't want to be killed by cars on the road? Don't be an asshole, safer driving = increased safety for *everyone*. Try to set your personal problems aside.
Doesn't seem like the cyclists will be getting much love from the CPD.
No, Navin, what I am talking about are those groups of bikers who feel so good about themselves for biking--they are saving the world, after all--and think that the fact they bike instead of drive allows them to ingore the law. I've come across these people all the time, and not only in bars frequented by bikers. As well, the complex is evident when these poor suffering bikers blame all the problems on drivers. Sorry, but it's not that simple.
I am pissed that I have to dodge reckless bikers breaking the law. This happens at least once a week when I am walking both in the Loop and the neighborhoods. I am pissed that some bikers think they are above the law. No group of people is above the law, no matter how "noble" that group is.
Don't you be an asshole, either. Obey the law at all times when you bike, and don't offer excuses for lawbreaking. And don't blame it all on drivers. Maybe bikers would get more respect if they followed the law. As it stands, reckless bikers, like reckless drives and reckless pedestrians, get they deserve when they are injured.
Whatever. Matilda, meet me at Glenwood and Ridge on a bike. You follow me as we ride our bikes north on Glenwood, a residential side street. The street is too narrow for cars to pass us if we stay out of the door zone. We'll come to complete stops at each stop sign, even if there is no cross-traffic (I always stop when there's cross traffic). We'll see if we can get half a mile before the rage begins.
Matilda must live in Shanghai.
Who are you to decide who "deserves" to be injured?? I'm sure you never act reckless ever, right? You have never jaywalked or rolled through a stop sign? Most vehicular accidents involve two negligent parties, which is why the law considers comparative negligence when addressing liability issues.
My brother-in-law saw a teenager get hit head on by a SUV while riding in the wrong direction in a bike lane on Halsted. The SUV got sick of waiting in traffic, cut into the bike land, and floored it. He was hit so hard his rear tire flew off the bike and rolled across the street. Amazingly, the kid lived. Sure, the kid was clearly negligent for riding in the wrong direction (south in a north bound bike lane), but so was the car for cutting into a bike lane in the first place. Everyone has a personal responsibility to do what they can to avoid accidents, but I don't think it is too much to ask for cars to exercise a bit of extra caution around bikers--even when they are acting reckless.
Mikely: So are you trying to say people have the right to disobey laws they find inconvienent? Seriously, that is all you seem to be saying here.
If so, why shouldn't drivers be able to do the same--say, turning right on red without a complete stop, or rolling stops if the intersection seems clear, or going 45mph in a 25mph residential zone, if only for a few blocks?
And, why do some bikers think they get a pass from traffic laws? How can you defend that?
Ad:
I don't drive, but when I rent a car, I never knowingly disobey traffic laws. I don't even do rolling stops.
I walk dozens of miles each week, and I never jaywalk, either. I think it is wrong and unsafe to all involved, especially me.
I agree: Drivers need to take better care. So do walkers. But bikers must stop thinking they are above the law. They are not. And those bikers, and drivers, and walkers, that continue to act recklessly deserve what they get.
As for your SUV example: The kid should not have been riding the wrong way. Fuck the biker and the driver in this instance. They were both reckless assholes, it seems.
I loved how, in your story, you try to put most of the blame on the driver. Great stuff.
Matilda, buy a bike and ride it down a one-way residential street that's too narrow for cars to pass you. Stop at every stop sign even when there is no cross-traffic (this is the only time I don't come to a stop). See how far you can get before the rage begins. I RARELY disobey any laws except in this instance. Obeying the law in this instance will put you in danger.
Chicago is full of motorists who blow lights and signs, turn right on red without stopping, come barrelling out of alleys, and turn through crosswalks within a few feet of pedestrians. You, however, seem to reserve the majority of your ire for people on 25 lb. bicycles. To the point that you claim to celebrate their injuries. You come across as disingenuous and angry. I just noticed that you've posted here almost three humdred times in the past month -- a clear indication of an unsatisfied soul incapable of any sort of rational exchange. Have a nice life.
Um, I actually pretty clearly stated that they were BOTH negligent. My main point, though, is have you ever heard of a driver being killed by a cyclist?? A cyclist's negligence generally results in a dented car. Sue the negligent asshole for the damage--I have no problem with that. A driver's negligence can kill a cyclist. It may sound cliche, but it's pretty fucking hard to pound a dent out of a cyclist's head.
Mikely: Perhaps you missed it, but I said that drivers and walkers need to obey the law. Can you read?
Thanks for the pop therapy. Dr Phil must be shaking in his boots.
Angry, yeah. There are alot of assholes in this city, not just bikers. Disingenuous? Only to small minds such as yours, I guess, or those who put too muck stake in ironic expression.
Again, you fail to address the question about why inconveinence excuses someone from obeying the law. Apparently, you have some issues as well, cowboy.
I am pissed that I have to dodge reckless bikers breaking the law. This happens at least once a week when I am walking both in the Loop and the neighborhoods.
Wow and once a week even, that sounds really traumatic Matilda, you have my deepest sympathies. Maybe a move to the country or L.A.'s in order? Somewhere away from this city that's so clearly overrun by reckless bike thugs...lol.
Navin, dodging reckless bikers once a week is too much, just as you on your bike or me on foot dodging reckless drivers is too much. Just as you shouldn't have to move to the country to bike, I shouldn't have to move to the country to walk.
I simply just don't understand how cyclists can legitimately justify breaking traffic laws. Just as I cannot justify jaywalking, or running a red. That is the issue.
You know what? I don't even have as much of a problem when bikers don't stop at a stop sign when there is no motor or foot traffic as long as they obey the spirit of the law. Bikers cannot even obey the spirit of a law. And I am not saying all bikers, but I see more bikers disobeying the law than obeying the law.
For all of the cyclists out there that obey the traffic laws: Thank you. For those that don't: fuck you.
Navin: If I can't bitch about reckless bikers, then you can't bitch about reckless drivers.
Why are so obtuse about this? This is exactly the attitude I am talking about among some bikers and some of their defenders.
You say move to LA. That is funny. Ever been to Amsterdam? I've been there a few times, and as you likely know, the city is overrun with bikes, and is denser than Chicago. Yet, I never feel as though I have to dodge reckless bikers (and I always make sure to obey the traffic laws, too, over there).
Why do some bikers in Chicago feel they are above the law? No one can yet answer that. All I get is move to LA.
I echo Sparky: Fuck you.
And I look forward to kicking your tires or throwing my coffee at you the next time you blow a stop sign or light. Good luck kicking my ass.
Yet, I never feel as though I have to dodge reckless bikers (and I always make sure to obey the traffic laws, too, over there).
Could the reason for that be that Amsterdam's about 10 billion times more friendly for bikers and walkers? Geez are you serious...
And I look forward to kicking your tires or throwing my coffee at you the next time you blow a stop sign or light. Good luck kicking my ass. (are you fucking 2 matilda?)
Good I'll make sure to steer clear of any retarded rage-filled toddlers spacing out in the middle of the road when I'm around town. Funny I never said anything about riding recklessly, I guess you assuming that *everyone* does justifies your totally bizarre and childish hatred of people who like to ride bikes be it sometimes or all the time. You should consider getting a bike you're obviously very stressed out and some excercise can do wonders for that.
Nobody has every answered me either as to why nobody goes off on all the bad drivers in the city whenever there's a story about somebody getting run down......
So, Navin, just because Chicago isn't as bike friendly as Amsterdam, that gives Chicago bikers the right to disobey traffic laws? Is that your bullshit position now?
I am not fucking 2. I am just a pedestrian sick of watching assholes take glee in breaking laws they expect everyone else to follow, and almost getting hit in return.
Are you fucking 2, Navin? Your logic makes you seem like a toddler.
Did you miss the point that drivers need to obey the law, too? Has anyone argued differently? I agree with Daley's proposal, though I doubt it wil be enforced. I agree with pumping money into making this city much more bike friendly. But I also think no one--bikers, drivers or walkers--should think they are above the law.
What is so fucking hard to understand about this? Are you really this stupid?
Again,
I never said anyone should be above the law so I don't know why you keep saying this to me. You're clearly more enraged about bikers rolling through a stop sign somewhere then about drivers or pedestrians acting foolish out in the road. Anyway I'll look out for the crazy lady with the starbucks foam dripping from her gnashing teeth and make sure to stay out of coffee toss, ass kicking and tire kicking range even though I'll just be, you know, riding by on a bicycle...
I am just a pedestrian sick of watching assholes take glee in breaking laws they expect everyone else to follow, and almost getting hit in return
Jesus,
Put a wallet in your mouth. On the *drive* home from the south side last night I had to swerve, slow down and generally avoid about 6 pedestrians playing frogger in various parts of the road from 95th up to about North ave. FUCKING PEDESTRIANS! ARGGGHHH! NEXT TIME I'M GOING TO FUCKING RUN THEM OVER!!!!!!!!AND BURN THEIR FACES WITH HOT COFFEE!!! what a world what a world!!!